Seanan McGuire (seanan_mcguire) wrote,
Seanan McGuire
seanan_mcguire
  • Mood: ecstatic
  • Music: The crows arguing outside my window.

ONCE BROKEN FAITH open thread!

To celebrate the release of Once Broken Faith, here. Have an open thread to discuss the book. Judging by the comments I'm seeing, some of you have had time, and I'd really, really rather book discussion (sometimes including spoilers) didn't crop up on other posts.

THERE WILL BE SPOILERS.

Seriously. If anyone comments here at all, THERE WILL BE SPOILERS. So please don't read and then yell at me because you encountered spoilers. You were warned. (I will not reply to every comment; I call partial comment amnesty. But I may well join some of the discussion, or answer questions or whatnot.) I will be DELETING all comments containing spoilers which have been left on other posts. No one gets to spoil people here without a label.

You can also start a discussion at my website forums, with less need to be concerned that I will see everything you say! In case you wanted, you know, discussion free of authorial influence, since I always wind up getting involved in these things.

Have fun, and try not to bleed on the carpet.
Tags: discussion post, once broken faith, toby daye
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colliemommie

September 6 2016, 23:58:37 UTC 10 months ago

It's finally the various spawns' bedtimes, and I am free to read! Yaaaaay!

evaleastaristev

September 7 2016, 00:47:43 UTC 10 months ago

It dropped early on my Nook device, so I started reading at 10pm last night. I woke up at 5am with my tablet leaning against my face, rolled over and went back to sleep, woke up and finished it. I just COULD NOT STOP READING!

Highlights for me include:

"Slumber" party. The thought of Dean watching The Little Mermaid and Dianda's reaction to that...I wish we could see it.

Quentin waking up to the sound/smell of pancakes. That was priceless.

Toby coming to the realization that while she can die...it's not necessarily permanent. And poor Jin. Poor, poor Jin having to be the medic for heroes.

I'll give it a second read here in a bit. Catch those little things I inevitably missed the first time through. As usual, so much love for these books, and Toby would definitely murder Seanan, slowly, if she ever made it off the page.

Dianda's reaction to the Little Mermaid

M Reed

September 7 2016, 21:44:39 UTC 10 months ago

Might I suggest a web exclusive (very) short story on the subject of Dean's discussion with Dianda on the subject of The Little Mermaid, preferably with the presentation of appropriately themed merchandise?

Re: Dianda's reaction to the Little Mermaid

deborah_c

10 months ago

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RE: Dianda's reaction to the Little Mermaid

Dinosaurearings

10 months ago

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brightone

September 7 2016, 02:09:10 UTC 10 months ago

I'm only a few chapters in but...

After seeing you tweeting so much about that (ADORABLE) axolotl Kickstarter the other day I was beyond amused when the Luidaeg mentioned turning all the teenagers into axolotls.

fiveforsilver

September 7 2016, 13:48:16 UTC 10 months ago

I WANT FANART of the axolotl slumber party! Please? Somebody??

dragonsong

10 months ago

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melchar

September 7 2016, 02:26:32 UTC 10 months ago

VERY happy book day! I just ordered 'Once Broken Faith' because I'd managed to be otherwise oblivious to the new Toby book, until I read your LJ post. I mean, I have 'Feedback' & 'Magic for Nothing' already pre-ordered, but biffed on Toby.

THANK YOU for letting me [and others] know that there was another wild Toby to be obtained! [You are super-effective!]

chantry

September 7 2016, 04:52:15 UTC 10 months ago

Tybalt being staked, and Toby's fight to keep him alive, literally had me in tears. When Toby turned to see him there at the dinner, I actually cried out loud, "No, no, no, no!" and started crying. I mean, great, heaving sobs that made it almost impossible to finish reading that chapter.

And I never cry. Never, ever.

Gemma Mason

September 8 2016, 06:28:19 UTC 10 months ago

I seriously believed he might die, there. Like, it was totally written as though this could be the tremendously affecting death scene. I was very glad for Toby's sake that it was not.

chantry

10 months ago

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jenk

9 months ago

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chantry

9 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

September 7 2016, 05:37:12 UTC 10 months ago

Where to start? Oh, I know, I loved it! I adored the brief, unguarded glimpses we got of the Luidaeg's almost maternal fondness for Karen. That carried over into the novella, and the way she spoke to Cassie. Something fairly jumped out at me too, Arden's confusion when she saw Cassandra without her illusion. Is there something yet to be revealed about the Brown children's heritage, I wonder?

Things are changing, and I wonder if Toby realizes just how much they're likely to change. Until recently she's been a local affair, but now her name is known throughout the Westlands. I understand the political angle to offering Toronto as a location for the wedding, but I'm thinking there may be more to it than that, that perhaps Aethlin and Maida want to send a message that they approve of this union, and particularly October.

I loved the whole journey, from novel through novella, but I have to single out the part I loved absolutely the best. For the contest last month we were asked to name one thing we'd like to see in an upcoming Toby book. Mine was to see the rift between Toby and the Torquill's mended, and I'm delighted to see half that accomplished here. The other half, well, Sylvester was the easy part.

Oh, one last remark - Walther & Cassandra, ADORABLE.

The Brown children's heritage

M Reed

September 7 2016, 21:51:10 UTC 10 months ago

Toby makes a very similar remark in the main text (in regards to Karen rather than Cassie) -- specifically, wondering if Karen might be a changling (in the original meaning of the word -- a child swapped at birth). Toby /didn't/ actually try to measure Karen's heritage, however.

Just throwing this out there: Perhaps they are the Roane reborn? I believe it was mentioned in one of the past books that they were a race of Seers. If true, this /would/ tie up quite a few loose ends, wouldn't it?

Re: The Brown children's heritage

deborah_c

10 months ago

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RE: Re: The Brown children's heritage

kashiqueen

10 months ago

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RE: Re: The Brown children's heritage

jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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RE: Re: The Brown children's heritage

hasufin

10 months ago

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RE: Re: The Brown children's heritage

beccacivi

10 months ago

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museclio

10 months ago

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The Brown's children

ginaslone

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

M Reed

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

jenk

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

beccacivi

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

ginaslone

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

dragonsong

10 months ago

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RE: The Brown's children

ginaslone

5 months ago

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Re: The Brown's children

ginaslone

4 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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Bill Silvia

September 7 2016, 05:43:00 UTC 10 months ago

I'm probably not sleeping tonight. Work in six hours and reading OBF.

I'm seven chapters in and Toby's not drenched in anybody's blood, and nobody's dead. What witchcraft is this?

wendyzski

September 8 2016, 15:42:41 UTC 10 months ago

She makes up for it later :)

Gemma Mason

10 months ago

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methylviolet10b

September 7 2016, 06:26:14 UTC 10 months ago

So, so, sooooo good! I gulped it down as fast as my poor eyes could devour it. I'll undoubtedly re-read it several times before the week is out, just to make sure I didn't miss anything.

One thing for sure, though - for as action-packed and heart-pounding as it was (and there were so many ACK NO ACK!!! moments!), there certainly looked like a lot of setup work, too. And Toby...oh Toby. So understandable why she did what she did, both with the fire and the phial, but...

"Yeah. I guess you'd have to."

EEEEEP!

You're awesome. It was amazing.You deserve all the toast (and peanut butter, and chocolate, and sparkly amazing staircases). And I can't wait to see what happens next.

Bill Silvia

September 7 2016, 06:45:31 UTC 10 months ago

I'm probably not sleeping tonight. Work in six hours and reading OBF.

I'm seven chapters in and Toby's not drenched in anybody's blood, and nobody's dead. What witchcraft is this?

listicath

September 7 2016, 10:48:26 UTC 10 months ago

Where else, but a Seanan McGuire book would we find weaponised fairy rings? :-)

And what was that the Luidaeg said to Toby? "You have to take care of yourself. Replacing you would take a long time, and frankly, I don't want to go to the trouble."

What have you and the Luidaeg got in store for poor Toby?

deborah_c

September 7 2016, 14:38:30 UTC 10 months ago Edited:  September 7 2016, 14:39:11 UTC

I'm curious, though, as to how two entirely separate sets of rulers, from different bits of the country, hit on using exactly the same method that no one in Toby's côterie twigged, even the Luidaeg. Is there an éminence grise (or maybe blanche) out there pulling strings, or was Michel just very, very bright? He didn't give that impression elsewhere...

Also: poor, poor barrow wights :-(

vatine

10 months ago

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deor

10 months ago

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deborah_c

10 months ago

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vatine

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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marabett

September 7 2016, 13:10:51 UTC 10 months ago

More later, but one of my favorite parts was how Toby acknowledged that hey, she's not the greatest private detective ever, but she's infinitely better at it than the pureblooded fae could (probably) ever be because they find it so difficult to process anything as being urgent due to the immortality thing.

alexcansmile

September 7 2016, 15:12:27 UTC 10 months ago

I learned so much about the Luidaeg in that novella - it explains /so much/. Once Broken Faith was amazing, but I think Dreams and Slumbers was my favorite part.

When Tybalt was stabbed I had to put the book down. And his joy at being woken up and Toby's ears being the same, her not having changed. Be still my heart! I think Tybalt and the Luidaeg are my favorite characters. I wish they'd get along better.

replyhazy

September 7 2016, 16:06:29 UTC 10 months ago

Ten chapters in. Had to leave iPad at home because otherwise I would try to read during work (inexplicably frowned upon).

THANKS FOR THE MAP!!!!!

lazzchan

September 7 2016, 16:31:48 UTC 10 months ago Edited:  September 7 2016, 16:36:41 UTC

I meant to write this review at some point past midnight when I finished reading, but my cat was on my lap and I simply could not dislodge him. It was also hard to type through my tears because of all of the ending bits with Tybalt and Walther and Quentin. My neighbor probably heard a lot of shouted NOOOO whilst I was reading. There was just so much in here and so much laid out that there were also quite a few "gdi Seanan's" sprinkled amongst the tears and denials.

There was a TON said here! The hints about the smaller magics and fairy rings (makes me wonder about certain people now, but only gonna wonder) What the hell is October's purpose in the overall scheme of things, because holy gods there is something going on there that is just making my jaw drop at everything Luidaeg is saying outright. What she said to Arden. What Evening said to October. That is making my hackles rise and throw the book and just sort of sob because there is something brewing and if Evening is all for it... I don't think we want it.

The bits of Maeve and Titania and Oberon... what the courts used to be like, what they could be, What October actually means in the whole scheme of things and I'm just over the moon and slightly sad now that the book is over and I have to wallow in my misery of waiting a year (and probably having nothing answered for several more books). VERY interesting how the one court questioned the balance of Toby's blood. She's shifted that far over that she's not even close to being half-- they figured it was further back and that's astonishing as to the implications.

The fact that she is... not really immortal, but something so close to it, is very scary. Toby can very much, like her mother and her auntie, be considered one of the 'monsters' of Faerie.


Thank you so much for writing and letting us have another piece of the world you've constructed.

belegwen

September 7 2016, 22:42:00 UTC 10 months ago

I'm pretty sure Toby didn't start life as half. I think she's wrong about who her father is.

lazzchan

10 months ago

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Gemma Mason

10 months ago

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belegwen

10 months ago

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ravensquee

10 months ago

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Gemma Mason

10 months ago

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jenk

10 months ago

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Gemma Mason

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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phoenix_singing

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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crewgrrl

8 months ago

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dragonsong

10 months ago

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Jummai Akale

September 7 2016, 20:36:14 UTC 10 months ago

Just finished it. I don't think I can wait a year, I should've paced myself. Anyway, this is just a grateful post, Toby has become one of my favourite female protagonists.

mrs_norris_mous

September 7 2016, 21:38:52 UTC 10 months ago

Being in the UK I got to read the book on a day off last Friday, It was lovely.

Thank you.

belegwen

September 7 2016, 22:40:32 UTC 10 months ago

I love how Toby didn't even consider saving her humanity by having the Luidaeg lock her in a fairy ring for a hundred years--because all the people she would be abandoning in that time, I assume. So glad she didn't have to make the sacrifice.

And now I'm looking forward to that wedding even more!

deborah_c

September 8 2016, 00:01:03 UTC 10 months ago

Also on fairy rings:

We got to hear that the Ride of the King and Queens had been "compromised" (or similar, the book's upstairs). And we've known for a long time that they "just disappeared". And now we have the idea of fairy rings, which will last a hundred years trivially, longer if there's the magical power available.

We also know that, to some extent, Eira Rosynhwyr was being reined in a little by the monarchs (presumably significantly Maeve), and that she (and her descendants) are power-hungry. She's the person that would have stood to gain most from their absence. And she has more power than pretty much anyone else around. Assuming that continues to hold while she's asleep, that is, but clearly Eira being asleep isn't the same as other people, from Karen's predicament here.

And her not-quite-mortal enemy, or at least "balance", is the Luidaeg, who is bound by the strictures of the missing Titania, has lost most of her siblings (through unstated means), and doesn't have Maeve there any more.

I've thought for a while now (three or four books) that Amandine's line are there to be the heroes who can right injustices; we're told (I forget where) that those claimed by Oberon are heroes. (Although not exclusively, since Sylvester was a hero too.) And August, the (only?) other descendant disappeared questing before the 1906 SF earthquake, which we might assume was linked to Amandine raising hell looking for her, possibly with some Torquill assistance. I've thought for a bit that August went off hunting for the disappeared King and Queens, and Eira stopped her; Toby's the remaining possibility for now, hence the Luidaeg's "without a lot more preparation" comment (again, not verbatim, because walking upstairs hurts) -- she really doesn't want to lose Toby as well, lest she have to find Amandine and make sure she produces another heroinette...

Exactly how this ties up with the Luidaeg's plans for the Selkies and (maybe?) rebirth of the Roane is anyone's guess, except, of course, Seanan's. And I'm probably conspiracy-theorising horribly, but it amuses me, at least ;-)

lazzchan

September 8 2016, 05:10:56 UTC 10 months ago

If Toby can shift the blood of the the changelings to go one way or another, what is the possibility she could... change the selkies all the way back to Roane? That's a disturbing thought all in its own, but Toby's power is very strong and not cataloged to all of what it can accomplish.

ivymutant

10 months ago

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dragonsong

10 months ago

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bree_ramsey314

10 months ago

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jenk

10 months ago

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lazzchan

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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jenk

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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jenk

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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kitan

10 months ago

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jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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leapersonata

September 8 2016, 05:05:26 UTC 10 months ago

I started swearing aloud at work when Toby found Madden on the stairs, because fuck, Arden does not deserve that. I'm so glad he didn't die.

Tybalt's injuries I mostly just went through desperately hoping that you wouldn't kill HIM you WOULDN'T PLEASE TELL ME YOU WOULDN'T EVEN THOUGH YOU PROBABLY WOULD I'M GOING TO PRETEND YOU WOULDN'T and that turned out okay and also prevented me from bursting into tears at work, which my manager probably appreciated.

I hope DAW keeps buying these books from you until you've finished all the story you have to tell about Toby. I can see little puzzle pieces fitting in here and there, but I have no idea what the picture they make is, and I really look forward to finding out.

groblek

September 8 2016, 05:22:05 UTC 10 months ago

So much to love in this one, and in the accompanying novella. I think the Luidaeg remains my favorite character - I enjoy the way she goes from gruff auntie-type figure to ancient Power at a moment's notice. And her calling Arden out for getting too familiar was perfect.

The slumber party was wonderful. And Dianda remains another favorite character, I really loved the bit with "if we don't get to use the cure and she sleeps a hundred years, then you'd better hope she knows the maning of mercy." "She doesn't." Also the idea that she's what passes for a pacifist among her people is utterly terrifying. Do not annoy the Undersea.

And I found myself particularly glad that Arden is a likeable character, for reasons that are probably unique to me. While my usual reaction to the descriptions of the smell of a character's magic ranges from "I can't visualize that" to "ew", I had a visceral reaction to the first mention of Arden's magic. I'm a fog chld of the redwood coast, and to me "blackberry flowers and redwood sap" is the smell of *home*. For similar reasons, if it weren't for the whole "mortals tend to fare badly when dealing with Faerie" thing, I'd really want a chance to wander through her knowe.

jenfullmoon

September 9 2016, 14:09:40 UTC 10 months ago

Adjusting to being a queen and a big shot around everyone--and then oh, wait someone's more of a big shot than me--must be weird for Arden in both directions.

I hope Arden and the Luidaeg literally don't not see each other for a hundred years (hoping that was just in reference to Arden looking for help). That seems impractical in these books.

I seriously wish I could befriend Arden, it sounds like she needs a book nerd friend among this bunch that will treat her "normal" so bad.

I liked how Toby was calling out the blackberry theme on EVERYTHING.

museclio

September 8 2016, 13:29:05 UTC 10 months ago

Thank you.

lysystratae

September 8 2016, 16:00:43 UTC 10 months ago

Banana slugs!

tylik

September 9 2016, 21:19:52 UTC 10 months ago

+1

(This is a sea slug, not a banana slug, but hey.)

stillwordgirl

September 8 2016, 18:29:48 UTC 10 months ago

I'm only 14 chapters in, but ... "Go pick yourself a rose, little girl. That's always worked out so well for your family." (Evening to Toby, chapter 13.)

Oh, my. Further fuel for the Tam Lin theories, which I love...

yukistorm32

September 8 2016, 23:20:37 UTC 10 months ago

I just finished rereading Once Broken Faith again and there's something bothering me.......

In Chimes at Midnight, Toby owed a favor to the night haunts.

However, in Once Broken Faith Toby mentions that she did the favor..

Did I miss something or is Seanan McGuire going to give us a short story about that?

jenk

September 9 2016, 00:25:20 UTC 10 months ago

She stopped the goblin fruit problem in San Francisco.

As a bonus, she also helped a bunch of changelings in Silences.

jenfullmoon

10 months ago

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beccacivi

10 months ago

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jenk

September 9 2016, 00:27:25 UTC 10 months ago

The High Queen of North America is (was?) a changeling. Wow.

jenfullmoon

September 9 2016, 14:12:51 UTC 10 months ago

No wonder Maida's so nice!

Did not know there was an entire changeling Nation, though to be honest I'm still confused as to why they want people to be elf-shot. I did not get that logic.

M Reed

10 months ago

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