Seanan McGuire (seanan_mcguire) wrote,
Seanan McGuire
seanan_mcguire

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Seanan loves her some fanfic, yes she does: on transformative works.

Fanfic has come up several times in the past few days. People I know have been talking about it, either in the context of "is fanfic okay?" or "this piece of fanfic is awesome!" And with The Hunger Games about to appear on the big screen, we're standing on the precipice of a vast flood of fic, some based on the movie, some based on the original books, and some trying to reconcile the inevitable differences between the two. Oh, and there will be banging. So. Much. Banging. Because regardless of the source material, that's what roughly fifty percent of fanfic is for. And because of all this, I've been thinking about fanfic.

Not that it's hard to make me think about fanfic. Yesterday, for example, I spent a relaxing hour during my "lunch break" (a nebulous concept on a Sunday, admittedly, but since I worked all damn day, I wanted a lunch break) reading Glee fanfic. Most of it was Rachel/Quinn, which is not a 'ship I necessarily endorse on the show itself, but which has attracted some really awesome authors whose work I hugely enjoy. I became a professional author largely because I had been writing fanfic for so many years that I was eventually able to level up and start playing in my own sandboxes. I love fanfic. I love it. And because I've been thinking about fanfic, I wanted to make a few statements about fanfic.

Fanfic can teach you how to write.

I'm serious. If you have a good critique group, usually referred to as "beta readers," to go over your work before you post it, fanfic can be a great tool for learning how to put together a good sentence, a good paragraph, and a good overall narrative. You have to be ready to hear criticism, because the fanfic community is also a great place to go for unrelenting praise, but if you're ready, the tools for improvement are there. Playing in someone else's world is an excellent way to dodge the initial world building step, and get straight to dialog, composition, and the all-important "building a good story." It lets you hone your tools in a safe place, and that's incredibly helpful.

I didn't learn how to build good worlds from fanfic; I had to start doing my own thing before I could learn, and apply, that lesson. But I learned to write good dialog from fanfic, and I learned how to make people care. The fanfic community was hugely important to, and influential toward, my development as a writer.

Again, there are some pitfalls to this approach. Fanfic can easily become a closed circuit of production and praise, where people who want to read exactly what you're writing tell you how awesome you are, so you write the same thing over and over again, without any growth. Fanfic can seem like an excuse to be sloppy. But if you're approaching it seriously, which many really good fanfic authors do, it can teach you an incredible amount about writing, about receiving critique, and about taking editorial feedback. The first really thorough editorial feedback I ever received was on a piece of fanfic, and I have held those lessons dear to my heart since I was sixteen years old. Fanfic is an awesome learning lab, and the only credentials you need to enter are a knowledge of a fandom you'd like to write in, and the willingness to be told when you're terrible.

Fanfic gives you the freedom to do things that are difficult to do in more traditional fiction.

Some of my favorite things to both read and write in fanfic are "mood pieces," little meandering stories that don't do anything but paint a picture of a moment, or look at an event from a different direction. They're all about introspection and re-framing, and when they're good, they're amazing. But they're not the sort of thing that sells. I can (and do) write them about my published series, but they're not the sort of thing that generally winds up finding a very wide audience. And in fanfic, that doesn't matter. I've written stories with a projected audience of three. All three people were happy, and I was content.

I love AU fanfic—alternate universe stories where things went a little different, someone died or didn't die or married their season one sweetheart or it's a Shakespearean tragedy or or or. And AU is hard in traditional fiction. I've managed to play around with it a bit in "Velveteen vs.", where I have the superhero framework as an excuse, but I doubt Toby will ever meet her cross-dimensional counterpart (which is a pity, because I bet it would be fascinating). I like having the option to twist things and see how everything unfolds from a new starting point.

Fanfic can help you find your voice.

I know people who say "why don't all those fanfic writers just play in their own worlds?" And the thing is, some of them will, some of them do. People don't have to choose one or the other, absolutely, no mixing or matching. A lot of fanfic authors go on to become professional authors, and keep on writing fanfic in whatever spare time they have. I am not a special snowflake in this regard. I belong to a blizzard. There are a lot of reasons that people write fanfic. Sometimes we do it because we're in love with a setting that someone else has created. Sometimes we do it because we want to fix what we view as flaws, or create a more balanced back story for a character we feel has gotten short shift, or just because we feel like it. Sometimes we do it because we're bored.

But every time we do it, even when we're trying to sound like the original creator, we're getting a little more solid in our own voices, in the ways that we shape and approach narratives. We find ourselves in the space between someone else's story. At the end of the day, is learning to write by producing reams of Buffy the Vampire Slayer fanfiction any less legit than retelling "Snow White" eighty-seven times? I don't think so. It's less commercial, since you can't (and shouldn't) sell your fanfic, but it's still a natural part of figuring out who you are as a writer.

Not every writer will write fanfic. Not every writer needs to, or wants to. But for those of us who do, it helps us find ourselves. And that's important.

Fanfic is just plain fun.

I wrote a Josie and the Pussycats/Veronica Mars crossover fic once.

I think that sort of says it all.

Fanfic can change the way you think about a story.

I've heard a few people say that everyone who writes fanfic is a spoiling spoiler who spoils, throwing mud and slime all over something beautiful. And everyone has a right to an opinion. But while I have never had a piece of fanfic change my opinion of a story negatively, I have had pieces of fanfic make me look at the original work in a new, and much more open-minded, way. Because fanfic shows love, and love means there's something there for me to care about.

I've never read a piece of fic and thought "ew, I'm never reading/watching the source material." The opposite is very much true. Good fanfic, inspired fanfic, brings new eyes to the table, and new eyes are never a bad thing. Having my view of the story transformed makes me more willing to accept where the original narrative goes, and more likely to stick around for the ride. I've never dropped out of a fandom where I was actively invested in the fanfic. Again, the opposite is very much true.

And now, the big thing...

I cannot officially know about fanfic based on my work, but that doesn't mean I hate it.

Like many authors, I find myself in an awkward position regarding fanfic based on my own work. So here is my official stance on the subject:

Don't tell me.

I have Google spiders; it's entirely possible that I will unofficially find out about your epic Toby/Tybalt Candyland slash party. But I promise to delete that notification without clicking through if you promise not to push the story in my face. If I officially know about it, I officially have to ask you to take it down, because there's no way to prove I didn't read it if it turns out that, say, Toby and Tybalt really are going to have a threeway with the Luidaeg on the top of Candy Mountain. So just don't officially tell me about it. If you write a lot, the odds are good that you and I could end up in the same archive. That's cool. I won't fuss about it if you don't.

I love fanfic for everything it does for writers, and for readers, and if in ten years, the author of the hot new urban fantasy series shyly tells me that she got her start writing Quentin/Raj sexy boys' adventure fic, I will applaud, hug her, and probably buy her dinner. I want fanfic to thrive forever and forever, and keep producing amazing stuff for me to read. And the day the very last Toby book is published, I am doing a huge fanfic websearch, diving into some archives, and reading myself sick.
Tags: contemplation, fanfiction
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Aw, they're not going to have a threesome, then?

Better take that off of my guessing list for the next book. XD
I think my brain would actually shut down trying to write that. Seriously. I would blue screen of death MY ACTUAL BRAIN.

sheistheweather

5 years ago

lysystratae

5 years ago

stevemb

5 years ago

dornbeast

5 years ago

Mmmm, fanfic!

Mmmm, AU fanfic! (Yeah, I've got... at least half a dozen of those for my own stuff. Including one outlined in drabble-form. For the heck of it.)

Mmmm, fanfic where I didn't much like the original work (or was just "eh" on it), but can at least be glad it exists because of the fic!


...I do think you just scarred my poor brain with the Candyland threesome idea, though. O_O
Sorry!

archangelbeth

5 years ago

I love fanfic for everything it does for writers, and for readers

I just want to hug you for this post. Thank you!
If we ever wind up in the same space, there can be fic-lover's hugging!
I really, really appreciate your stance on fanfic. (Not that I write fanfic anymore, because I came to the conclusion that I can't write fiction worth a damn, but I do like reading it, when it's written to my taste.)
I try not to be hypocritical and hate the house that made me, when I have a choice in the matter.
My fandom alter ego might possibly be ficcing the crap out of Mass Effect 3 right now to fill in some blanks, so I understand the urge. ;) This is all a thoroughly sensible take on it, and as someone who's used fic as an anything-goes stylistic playground (since hey, what can it hurt?), I can attest that my writing got better out of the deal....
It's the kind of freedom that can be really, really good for you, if you use it to improve. I appreciate freedom.
We who are about to write salute you!
Yay!
Thanks for this, I don't write but I do enjoy my share of fan fiction.
Good on you.
This is a sane set of views on this. I have never comprehended the hatred of fanfiction; I think it's delightful that fans can interact with a world and characters they love in their own ways.
This is so awesome. I haven't written fanfic in ten years (my first and only fandom was Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles) but I love to read mood pieces (X-Men, Buffy, Doctor Who). I feel that fanfic really did teach me writing techniques.
Absolutely. It's amazing that way.
This is so nice to see. Writing fanfic is a natural human activity with thousands of years of history. I also really love it and the entire idea of it.

P.
People who feel like they have a genuine place in a work are a lot more devoted to it than those who don't.
Lady, you just keep giving me more reasons to love you :)
Yay! <3
I was writing originals before I started writing fanfic, and fanfiction requires many different skill sets, but it also shares a few with originals.

I like fanfiction because it's low pressure. No one has to worry about marketing or pay or any of that. It's just a good pasttime, and if you want to write fringe stuff, you can.

It helped me find my voice and develop my writing style. I can look from the beginning of my two-novel story to the almost end of it I'm at now, and I can see the growth in my writing.

Also, it may not teach you how to world-build, but it does teach you how to maneuver within a world, when to follow its rules and when to expand on those rules and when to break them. That's a useful skill in originals as well.

Also, the community is freaking awesome. So many people I know are only virtual for me.

So yeah, big thumbs up for fanfiction here.
Absolutely, on all these points.
*grins* And that's why I do fan fic panels.

Find your voice? Hell, drag the one you have inside out to play in the sunshine. Come on - let's dance.
Totally.
I've written a teeny bit of fanfic (Buffy and Warehouse 13 are the only 2 pieces I've done), although I don't read it much, but I think it's a wonderful way for people to channel their creativity and I believe it is a good way for someone to learn to write. It would be an excellent training ground for someone who wanted to work in TV. I'm pleased that an author has come out in support of it, after all the negativity from some other authors over the last couple of years.
I wish people weren't so all or nothing about it. I love fanfic. It's an amazing, welcoming community, and more authors should embrace it.
This is actually one of the best posts I've read about fic from a published author. I've been writing fic for years and years and yeaaaaaaaaaaaars, and it actually formed a big part of my university degree (I dual-majored in creative writing and costume design). I don't think I would be nearly the writer I am now without having that huge backbone of fanfiction, with the support framework it comes with. I can play with a scene between two characters that I don't have a place for in an original universe, without having to world-build just to make five lines of dialogue flow the way they should.

It's just very refreshing to read posts like this; I've seen a few different spins from other authors, and every time it's a great reminder of why I absolutely refused to be embarrassed by the fact that I spent six hours writing a Final Fantasy VIII meets NCIS one-shot or something equally ridiculous. There's a great quote that someone wrote in Time about fic as well:

"Fan fiction is what literature might look like if it were reinvented from scratch after a nuclear apocalypse by a band of brilliant pop-culture junkies trapped in a sealed bunker. They don’t do it for money. That’s not what it’s about. The writers write it and put it up online just for the satisfaction. They’re fans, but they’re not silent, couchbound consumers of media. The culture talks to them, and they talk back to the culture in its own language."


That's a lovely quote!

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

batyatoon

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

*applauds*
*curtseys*
Interesting post.

I am torn on fanfic. I have written some (after swearing for years that I never would, I ended up writing Jumper fanfic - of all the things to wind up with! - because someone had to write the epically awesome story that was in my head...), but it was not slash in any way.

The issue that I have with it is mostly when fans start getting more than a little creepy about picturing actors doing things that are Just Plain Wrong. I have fewer problems when it's characters from a story, because hey, that's not real people. But when someone starts describing tenth Doctor/fifth Doctor lovin', you just know who they're picturing, and I find that more than a little icky. Because what if it were me playing that role? So I am torn. In some aspects - fanfic is great for many of the reasons you describe. But in others, it can be disturbing and very invasive for the actors playing those roles. I would love to hear your thoughts on that, as you have described your position so well in your post.
I don't write fanfic, but I read a lot of it--including those that are based off TV shows (characters or actors). The thing I've noticed in some fandoms is that eventually, characters seem to develop fandom personalities(and even physical appearances) that are different from the ones in the shows/books/actual actors. So the fanfic seems almost based off the general fandom consensus, rather than the original source. So, say I did read tenth Doctor/fifth Doctor lovin', it's extremely unlikely I'm actually picturing the actors. At least, that's how it's like for me.

It doesn't help that I read a lot of AU, so when it ends up that...say Rachel from Glee is a pirate queen in space facing off, uh, Finn the space cop, with their ships fueled by the power of their singing --I'm really really am not picturing the actors at that point.

I expect this differs from each individual reader and writers though. For me personally, I don't find it morally wrong to read the things I do. However, I have my own lines that I don't cross and other people have their own lines. I think as long as people don't think that what they're reading is representative of the actual actors, then its fine. As for the actors in those roles--they're already in the public eye, and have their own public images. If the fanfics in question isn't affecting that public image for the vast majority of people, then I don't see how it's any more invasive then other fannish activities. I mean, I think a slash fic is a lot less invasive than paparazzi.

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

ebeneezerdark

5 years ago

luvtheheaven

2 years ago

because there's no way to prove I didn't read it if it turns out that, say, Toby and Tybalt really are going to have a threeway with the Luidaeg on the top of Candy Mountain.

BRAIN BLEACH! BRAIN BLEACH!
Hee hee hee.
<3!


fyi, i deleted my previous comment because I couldn't remember if you were the author who didn't like unsolicited advice; if so, sorry about that! *kicks self*
<3.

I did get the comment notice, and at the end of the day, I'm just not at Jim's level yet. So I'm waiting to see how things shake out with him, and various other authors who have taken similar positions, as I stay in safer waters.
Will you also be doing an archive dive after Blackout hits the shelves? I ask purely out of idle curiosity, of course.
Nope, because that world isn't closed yet, just those characters.

Charles Ellis

5 years ago

themysteriousg

5 years ago

janetmiles

5 years ago

choirperson

5 years ago

agrumer

March 12 2012, 22:12:12 UTC 5 years ago Edited:  March 12 2012, 22:16:52 UTC

If I officially know about it, I officially have to ask you to take it down, because there's no way to prove I didn't read it if it turns out that, say, Toby and Tybalt really are going to have a threeway with the Luidaeg on the top of Candy Mountain.

I hope this policy of yours isn't because of the widespread false rumors about some author (usually Marion Zimmer Bradley) being unable to publish a book because a piece of fanfic had the same idea. I'm pretty sure that never really happened.

What really did happen, in Bradley's case, is that she was publishing an anthology magazine of Darkover fic alongside the canonical books, and liked something from one of the submitted stories, and asked the fic author for permission to put it into one of the canonical books, and negotiations broke down.
When you say "negotiations broke down" you set short the end of the story--the canonical book that Bradley was working on did end up spiked. Most sources I've encountered have pinned the blame on the publisher, but the fact stands.

Jim C. Hines did an analysis of the situation in 2010. His conclusion was the same as Seanan's:

"The lesson I take from all this is to avoid potentially putting myself in Bradley’s position, and that means not reading fanfiction of my work. Sure, most fanfic authors I’ve met and spoken to have been wonderful people … but it only takes one. So if someone likes my work enough to write fanfiction, I find that flattering. But I don’t want to know about it."

(Other examples of the phenomenon exist. For example, J. Michael Straczynski shelved an episode of Babylon 5 for two years to track down and obtain clearances from a fan. Was it because the fan would actually sue? Arguably not. Was it because the fan could sue and the business was sufficiently risk-averse to not want to go near the issue until the release was in hand? Absolutely.)

agrumer

5 years ago

elialshadowpine

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

agrumer

5 years ago

psocoptera

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

Charles Ellis

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

*hugs*

It's my contention that the whole of Western art in the middle ages is basically Bible fanart, and that the Renaissance just expanded the archive by giving them access to the Greek and Roman gods.

I'm aware that not everyone agrees with me on this, though.

I think you're right.
If I ever do finish a novel, it will be because writing fanfic taught me the discipline to sit down and write 30K words in a month (which I did for the first time this past year.)

(This is where I mention that you wrote one of my favorite Doctor Who stories, and my very favorite Susan story.:)
Oh wow, do you mean the one with the park and the statue and the pony?! No one remembers that story! I love that story!

misachan

5 years ago

mls03j

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

mls03j

5 years ago

seanan_mcguire

5 years ago

1. I wrote 800,000 words of fanfic before my first short story was published.

2. I got over ANY fear of writing sex scenes.

3. I wrote a damn good crossover between Batman and Firefly.

Tl;dr, fanfic is teh awes.

Awesome!

airawyn

5 years ago

When I think about all of the people I never would have met, if I didn't write and read fanfic, my head explodes.

(Also, it means sometimes I end up at dinner with an executive producer of one of my fave TV series currently on the air, and discover he read my Gargoyles stories back when we were both at uni.)

It also prompted me to write a big meta post a few years back, about myself, and how I approach fanfic.
You wouldn't know me!
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