Seanan McGuire (seanan_mcguire) wrote,
Seanan McGuire
seanan_mcguire
  • Mood: tired
  • Music: Adele, "Rolling in the Deep."

LATE ECLIPSES open thread. Have a party.

To celebrate the release of Late Eclipses [Amazon]|[Mysterious Galaxy], here. Have an open thread to discuss the book.

THERE WILL BE SPOILERS.

Seriously. If anyone comments here at all, THERE WILL BE SPOILERS. So please don't read and then yell at me because you encountered spoilers. You were warned.

You can also start a book discussion at my website forums, with less need to be concerned that I will see everything you say! In case you wanted, you know, discussion free of authorial influence.

Have fun!
Tags: late eclipses, toby daye
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lysythe

March 3 2011, 17:13:19 UTC 6 years ago

I love spoilers. Spoil me. Ruin me. Make me salivate over not having it yet.

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 17:20:53 UTC 6 years ago

*backs away slowly*

cupcakery

March 3 2011, 17:13:39 UTC 6 years ago

Um, Team Tybalt all the way if there are going to be teams re: Tybalt/Toby/Connor.

I loved how Amandine is a literal blood-worker; she doesn't just read it, she changes it. Does this mean she would be able to make any changeling fully human?

From the preview for the next book, Quentin is going to be Toby's squire, right? Right?

bloolark

March 3 2011, 17:20:05 UTC 6 years ago

Yeah, I'm completely on Team Tybalt too. :)

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6 years ago

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bloolark

March 3 2011, 17:22:31 UTC 6 years ago

I really loved how this book was a game changer as far as Toby's bloodline goes. I felt that it was well hinted at without actually being something I had considered, and the surprise felt appropriate. Of course, now I desperately want to go back and reread all the other books to see your hinting, which I fully intend on doing. It also gave her more power in a way that felt realistic and right for her, rather than the typical 'new book, new power' that some other authors have done (*cough*Anita Blake*cough*) that end up with the protagonist being a tad on the unbelievable side.

Also, I'm completely in love with Tybalt, and continue to be in favor of 'all Tybalt all the time'. :)

bloolark

March 3 2011, 17:24:25 UTC 6 years ago

Oh, and also, I actually REALLY liked the characterization of Raysel in this one. I felt sorry for her, and I understood her hatred of Toby where I never had before. Way to make a good villain!

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rymenhild

March 3 2011, 17:22:55 UTC 6 years ago

The first thing I did when I finished the book was look up dóchas in an Irish dictionary. I got "hope, expectation." The hope of the Sidhe is ... death? rebirth? reinvention? Either way, I'm really, totally fascinated by the Dóchas Sidhe, and intrigued to see what their role might be in Faerie.

Also, Team Tybalt. (And I'm pleased that Toby is finally going to have the opportunity to choose openly between Tybalt and Connor!)

rymenhild

March 3 2011, 17:31:09 UTC 6 years ago

[Just to be clear, I wasn't asking a question, and I wouldn't want an answer if there were one. I'm just announcing the things I'm fascinated by. :)]

seanan_mcguire

6 years ago

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Up to chapter 12

mrs_norris_mous

March 3 2011, 17:24:38 UTC 6 years ago


Most excellent.

Re: Up to chapter 12

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 18:08:52 UTC 6 years ago

:)

Re: Up to chapter 12

mrs_norris_mous

6 years ago

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Re: Up to chapter 12

seanan_mcguire

6 years ago

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rymenhild

March 3 2011, 17:30:31 UTC 6 years ago

Also, can I say I love May's date to the ball?

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 18:09:09 UTC 6 years ago

So do I! Jazz is awesome.

jane_dark

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sparrowpunk

March 3 2011, 17:31:06 UTC 6 years ago

I spent yesterday afternoon trying to find an ebook I could get outside the USA and my desire to know what happened next triumphed over being too depressed and panicky to go out :D

Will be watching this thread with interest, though I'm less interested in Toby/Tybalt (Toby/anyone, to be honest- I've read so much Laurell K Hamilton that I fell on Twilight with cries of joy and a complete failure to notice the problematic bits just because it took them three books to have sex) than what's going to happen later with Amandine, Rayseline and how Goldengreen taking in the weak fae of Lily's knowe (court?) will affect things. And I've only read the book once, so I clearly need to reread it...

pola_bear

March 3 2011, 17:34:40 UTC 6 years ago

Yeah, the Goldengreen plot is really interesting. I have an image of toby making into her special home for abandoned changelings, which would be great, because there clearly aren't enough places that are available to them where they won't get used, like Devin did.

sparrowpunk

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saruby

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pola_bear

March 3 2011, 17:44:29 UTC 6 years ago

I really loved this book, I took more time to read than I normally would because I really wanted to savour it. When reading it I was thinking about how I love months as names, and that I totally love that I will have a month for a surname when I get married. I might not change in other situations, but dude, January as a surname is epic! *personal ramble*

I am still processing as I finished the book less than 5 minutes ago, but I like how the people who were around and accepted, but also planning on killing Toby have been dealt with a bit (though sad at Manuel's death, there was a resolution there). Julie is not completely fine, but seems likely to try and kill Toby now. And Raysel is a massive threat, but at least she is not a threat who is not allowed to be dealt with any more, if that makes sense.

The Luidaeg chapter was really interesting. I like how she kept to the rules in place, but also stretched them as she could for Toby. And she is Toby's aunt omg!

Do you not want speculation in here? If so possibly note it in the post, because otherwise I'd be putting loads of speculative questions in here, not ones I'd expect you to answer or comment on, but as part of the general discussion of the book, speculation often ends up as rhetorical questions. hope that was said in a douchey way, I just don't want to cause you more stress!

vixyish

March 3 2011, 18:12:04 UTC 6 years ago

I *LOVE* the Luidaeg. I really want to see a lot more of her past.

tsgeisel

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amandolin1

March 3 2011, 17:44:50 UTC 6 years ago

I still think Quentin being from Canada and the King and Queen holding court in Toronto are somehow related. I don't see them answering Sylvester's request for just anyone.

And the super sappy part of me was so happy to see Amandine come back. I just couldn't imagine anyone completely abandoning their child.

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liret

March 3 2011, 17:53:48 UTC 6 years ago

First, unformed thoughts:

I loved seeing more of the inner workings of Shadowed Hills - everyone in that dutchy is fascinating, and only partly because they all seem to be various kinds of insane.

I'm impressed with Quentin's growing up enough to be willing to bust Toby from the Queen's prisons - that's pretty hardcore rulebreaking for a kid so obsessed with protocol.

I also maybe had a hard time concentrating on anything else in the book after the image of Tybalt holding kittens.

amandolin1

March 3 2011, 17:58:45 UTC 6 years ago

Ah! The kittens! That was the hardest part of the book for me. Do whatever you want to the other characters, I expect that. But a little kitten? Thank goodness for Walther.

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hanabishirecca

March 3 2011, 18:02:24 UTC 6 years ago Edited:  March 3 2011, 18:03:19 UTC

I went back to the first book after reading this and reread the questions that Toby asked the Luidaeg. There were some very interesting things there. There is no doubt at all that this was all plotted out.

I need to reread the books to confirm on some theories of mine, but I'm starting to suspect that Toby is not a changeling at all. Or at least, if she is, I'm curious if her ability to shift her blood makes her percentage of bloodline completely moot.

And now I really want to know whats happened to Toby's daughter since Toby was turned into a fish. This is significant guys, very significant.

I'm curious what the Luidaeg was dealing with when Toby called. (Should Toby start calling her Aunt Luidaeg?)

And finally, I loved the Tybalt/Toby kiss.

vixyish

March 3 2011, 18:20:15 UTC 6 years ago

"Aunt Luidaeg"! BAHAHAHA! Oh I would love to see the Luidaeg's face, wouldn't you?

...actually maybe not.

:D

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hanabishirecca

March 3 2011, 18:08:02 UTC 6 years ago

I really didn't think that Luna was going to make it to the end of the book. After Lily died, I seriously thought she was going to die as well. I'm so glad that I was wrong.

seanan_mcguire

6 years ago

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evaleastaristev

March 3 2011, 18:18:03 UTC 6 years ago

I loved that the Rose Goblins played a large part in the book. Up to and including rampaging through Court to keep everyone distracted while they rescued Toby. I giggled for a full minute on that one.

pola_bear

March 3 2011, 18:34:24 UTC 6 years ago

I loved that aspect, too. I was so glad Spike was ok as well, as I was nearing shouting at the book that they needed to check on Spike pretty much the moment he returned to them after the ball. I was so worried he'd die. Them distracting court was awesome!

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evaleastaristev

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evaleastaristev

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jenjen4280

March 3 2011, 18:19:27 UTC 6 years ago

Thank you, thank you, thank you for May and Jazz.

Soooo....does Toby know whether or not her daughter has made the Changeling's Choice? Wouldn't that have occured during the time she was a fish?

Lost_Violet

March 3 2011, 18:55:37 UTC 6 years ago

I recall it being stated that she wouldn't need to, as she is 3/4 human.

Now, that was before the revelation that Amandine is one of the First born and that Toby's abilities had been manipulated. Would the actual strengths in Toby's blood/genes pass through to Gillian even though they were bound in Toby?

And I think it's been referenced that Toby has seen her from a distance since she ceased being a fish, so presumably if she had to make the choice, she chose human.

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liret

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liret

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xzxxzx

March 3 2011, 18:45:23 UTC 6 years ago

This was so worth going out in -28 C (not including windchill) weather to go buy. Wow, this was by FAR the best book IMO and I agree with the above comments on wanting to re-read the other books to see the hints I missed the first time around. I love the whole blood changing thing because it's a huge game changer. When this entire series is done.. I'd love to know how it was originally planned out, since it was planned to be spaced over fewer books originally. It would be interesting to see what would be missing. I had flashes of the same feeling I had when I read that one chapter in the very last Harry Potter book about Snape that changed the entire series for me (you know the one... I hope) in this book. It just turned the entire series on it's head in a wonderful way. It also makes me re-think everything I thought I knew about Toby and Tybalt's relationship. And now I'm dying for the next book... Which could easily be remedied... hint hint... joking.. mostly.

Oh.. and Tybalt. All the way.

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:49:19 UTC 6 years ago

Wow.

That's dedication.

Thank you!

Although the series was never directly spaced over fewer books, in terms of major events; if anything, it was spaced over more, with some of the revelations in book four not happening until books five or six.

sheistheweather

March 3 2011, 18:45:34 UTC 6 years ago

Now that we know that Gilly is the granddaughter of a Firstborn, I really wonder if her quarter-bloodedness will remain that way, or will affect whether or not she has powers.

I also wonder if Toby or Amandine might change her blood someday, to save her or otherwise.

Also, I found it very interesting that the scent of Toby's magic changed, and look forward to seeing her be able to do magic with less headache-inducing limitations.

rymenhild

March 3 2011, 18:48:25 UTC 6 years ago

But more new limitations! It's much harder now for Toby to handle her iron knife, for instance. I like that Toby's power-up is matched with a fresh set of problems.

sheistheweather

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seanan_mcguire

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consult your local metallurgist

vixyish

6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

sheistheweather

6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

vixyish

6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

sheistheweather

6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

vixyish

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

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6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

sheistheweather

6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

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6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

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6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

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6 years ago

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Re: consult your local metallurgist

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6 years ago

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6 years ago

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textileowl

March 3 2011, 18:49:39 UTC 6 years ago

Man, you know how to pack a punch, don't you?

I really like how Tybalt and Connor don't seem to have the typical manly fight going on over Toby. Granted, she's usually hieing off to injure herself in imaginative ways when all three are together, but the men managed to spring her in two days with no evidence of wanting to prove themselves against each other. It's refreshing.

Quentin is growing up to be an awesome person. I expect great things.

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 21:43:52 UTC 6 years ago

Me, too.

textileowl

March 3 2011, 19:03:33 UTC 6 years ago

Also, loved the inner workings of the court and the fact that Toby never understood the servant symbols. It's a clear indicator of where Toby stands in the court, for as much as she was a changeling and shouldn't fit in, she is a knight/now duchess and therefore doesn't know all the secrets.

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:50:25 UTC 6 years ago

Yay. :)

tsgeisel

March 3 2011, 19:14:50 UTC 6 years ago

I actually used the phrase "shake my finger at you in a threatening manner" at Pantheacon this year. I think it was my favorite line of the book.

I also enjoyed Walther's layman's description of the tests he was going to run.

Great character.

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:50:43 UTC 6 years ago

Awesome!

I love Walther. He makes me happy.

indilwen

March 3 2011, 19:26:32 UTC 6 years ago

I am so glad Luna is alive! She's one of my favorite characters. I don't think I could take it if Lily and Luna had both died.

Man, I love Tybalt. Not just because of the possibilities of Toby/Tybalt, but as a character. I like his unexpected sweetness almost as much as I like his scathing wit. His crying for Lily and for the little kitten broke my heart.

I love May, too. And I *really* love May and Jazz! I hope to see more of them as a couple in the future, because they are just so cute.

I'm also intrigued by Quentin's parents. His comment about them, and the response to it, implies that they might be more important, as characters and in the Fae hierarchy, than I thought. Hmmm...

Toby taking over Lily's protective role for the weaker was very cool. I was hoping that would happen :) I can't wait to see what happens with Goldengreen now that Toby is in charge of it. And of course I can't wait to see more of Toby. I really want to see how she deals with the new power and new weakness that come with being the daughter of a Firstborn Dóchas Sidhe.

I loved Oleander and Raysel. I was almsot sorry to see Oleander go -she was such an excellent villain. I'm sure that Raysel is more than up to the task, though. I wonder what Sylvester and Luna are going to do about her.

And lastly...rose goblins! I love them so much. I'm glad Spike is okay :)
I want a rose goblin for my very own. (My cats disagree)

~lily

ps -One Salt Sea looks like it is going to be thrilling! I'm so curious about the Undersea. September suddenly feels very far away...

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:55:12 UTC 6 years ago

May and Jazz are definitely sticking around. Well, May because she pays half the rent, but Jazz because she's a lot of fun, when she really gets to be part of the action.

groblek

6 years ago

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indilwen

March 3 2011, 19:30:20 UTC 6 years ago

Also: Toby and Quentin's trip to Great America? That has to happen!

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 20:55:46 UTC 6 years ago

It will, just...maybe not on paper.

jane_dark

March 3 2011, 19:36:19 UTC 6 years ago

I am definitely Team Tybalt, though I'm enjoying the slow development -- the pace at which romance happens in single novels always feels rushed to me. (Though if anyone could change that, it'd probably be you.)

Also: Walther was AWESOME. I wanted to trust him right from the start, he was so great, and so thank you for introducing him.

I really, really appreciated the way that you've been realistic about Raysel and Luna's emotional states and the effects of abuse throughout the whole series.

I don't mean this as a spoilery question, so feel free to ignore it entirely, but this volume made me think that if you ever offer a series of explanatory posts, that I'd like one on how people know about different races in faerie. I remember you touching on this briefly in the post about fae marriage and interbreeding, but I was curious about how it would happen that Oberon would create a race (well, create one member of it, if Amandine's the only one, which I suppose isn't guaranteed), and who would know of it. All the Firstborn? Firstborn who are smart like the Luidaeg, but not crazy like Blind Michael?

That's not meant as a criticism, by the way. I trust that I'll understand more about it in the future, and I understood enough that I was curious, rather than confused in this volume.

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:56:53 UTC 6 years ago

Whenever one of the Three has a kid, they're Firstborn. So Oberon had a daughter, Amandine, and that created the potential for a new race. Some Firstborn will always have children of the same race; others may be the parents of multiple races (see also "Acacia").

The Firstborn talk to each other. Blind Michael and Acacia both knew. Read their dialog to Toby carefully. :)

jhyanmar

March 3 2011, 19:39:15 UTC 6 years ago

I really liked the book; I just got into the series this Christmas, and I've been eagerly awaiting every new part with ravenous hunger. I have to wonder just how wrong the Queen of Mists is about Toby-- specifically, the fact that she believes Toby is the cause of the chaos in her realm. If she's been going insane, I wonder if she's actually CAUSING the chaos to swirl in-- the Fisher King principle for knowes might be affecting all of the demenses that owe fealty to her. Her madness might be feeding on it.

Worse, I wonder how much the Faerie Courts are tied to (Fae-twisty, of course) sense of rightness from their rulers. Again, looking at the Fisher King effect... the Queen didn't just use loopholes, or so it seemed; she utterly refused to use the truth, relied on witnesses that were almost certainly kknown to her to be biased and vengeful (including insanity). Then she ignored the principles of defense, the feudal obligations, etc. Effectively, at the end, she pronounced torture most vile, and terrible death... and her words to Toby seem to outright indicate that she did so knowing that Toby was probably innocent, and everything she was stating, lies. Given the FKE... it makes me wonder if there'll be kharmic retribution on her or her realm as a result.

I may be reading too much into things, though; I tend to.

My one worry out of reading it is Oleander's last words, which feel like death prophecy-- or an interpretation of prophecy. I really hope that that Toby doesn't end up causing a The Magic Goes Away scenario. Even finding the original home of the Fae and sealing them off there would seem to rob the world of its wonder to me (and the possibility of more books in a world I love.) Dunno, though; again, I tend to overthink, especially with books I adore.

seanan_mcguire

March 4 2011, 15:57:23 UTC 6 years ago

I promise there will not be a Magic Goes Away scenario. Beyond that, I cannot say.

jhyanmar

6 years ago

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amazon_syren

March 3 2011, 20:03:07 UTC 6 years ago

YAY for visibly queer characters. Srsly. Thanks for that.

I'm still wondering about Tam Lin and how Amandine is related to how Maeve's ride got stopped. (Didn't Luna say something about how Amandine could [fix it?] in Artificial Night?) I think it's tied to what Oleander was saying at the end and, possibly, when Luidaeg mentioned having some "issues" with her sister.

*I'm* curious about what Amandine said in the dream/memory -- about "how much of who you are is what you are". How is Toby going to change now that she's aware that she can shove her bloodtype around. How much is she going to change now that she's significantly more Faye than Human?


Also: I'm stupidly chuffed about Amandine being firstborn.

seanan_mcguire

March 3 2011, 21:11:21 UTC 6 years ago

Very welcome.

And Amandine's always been Firstborn; keeping my mouth shut when people wondered about it was SO HARD.

jhyanmar

March 3 2011, 20:16:14 UTC 6 years ago

Also, is it wrong of me to want to tell my students I'll "totally go Luidaeg" on them if they don't stop talking while other students are answering problems?

amandolin1

March 3 2011, 20:32:36 UTC 6 years ago

No, not at all. Just don't threaten them with Oleander. That would be a bit extreme.

jhyanmar

6 years ago

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6 years ago

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6 years ago

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6 years ago

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